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Discussion Starter #5
brake dust!

Thank you for the advice. I have just been taking a towel to them and wiping them off. It's sooooo annoying! :x I read on here someone else asked about that...as well.

I gave up on constant cleaning and bought Kleen Wheels, wheel inserts.
Now, as for these.. where did you get these?? Net shop in your town? Finally roughly what did they run you?

Thanks all! :D
 

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Kleen Wheels

There has been a set of Kleen Wheels on my 300SD ever since I purchased it with 105,000 miles. No overheated caliphers or warped rotors to date. I drive across the Eastern Continental Divide and down and up the eastern face of the Blue Ridge in NC daily. If you drive in extreme conditions where braking is heavy, you may want to reconsider, otherwise no problem.

I should note that, although I live in the mountains, the diesel has far greater engine braking power than the gassers, and I use it!

I did open the vents on the Kleen Wheels more than what the stamping machine allowed. Also note that they are unidirectional (there are right and left pieces).
 

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Re: Kleen Wheels

RivermasterNC said:
I should note that, although I live in the mountains, the diesel has far greater engine braking power than the gassers, and I use it!
Many years ago, a high performance driving instructor once chided me severely for using the engine to brake. I quickly came to realize the sagacity of his words, and now, IMHO, I feel that if the designers had intended for an engine to be used for braking rather than accelerating, they'd be throw-away units that would only cost $100, quite like brake pads. They would not be the $10,000, precision machined, high compression, engineering marvels that they are.

And that doesn't include the deleterious effects on the transmission, either.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled topic...


I wax my wheels to help in my efforts to keep them clean. I'd rather be able to see the discs and calipers and a little brake dust (okay, okay -- a lot!) than use any kind of a cover that may even theoretically be damaging to my car, especially just to help keep it clean.

My $.02(US),
Aaron
 

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Braking by using the engine, particularly in a diesel, is a simple matter of releasing the accelerator. Transferring more braking to the engine means releasing the accellerator earlier in anticipation of needed slowing.

Does your friend propose continued fuel delivery when slowing is called for?

Try coasting your gasoline powered car behind a diesel when he decides to coast. With an 18:1 compression ratio in the Diesel, you be hitting the brakes or his bumper.
 

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I'm not advocating running into anyone's bumper because they don't light their brake lights, regardless of engine compression. :roll:

You may certainly use your $10,000 engine to decelerate your car. I choose to use my $100 disposable brake pads, as they were designed. :) It's your car, your engine, your decision, just as using the brakes to slow my car is my choice. I just wanted to relay my Porsche certified high performance driving instructor's opinion on the matter when I saw someone advocating the opposite.

Cheers,
Aaron
 

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Alphaman:

Welcome to the BenzForum and welcome to the group of MB owners. I believe I read in another one of your posts that you just got your car. Congratulations! Post a picture when you get a chance.

Continuing our discussion:

My guess would be that your "Porsche certified high performance driving instructor's opinion " was referring to agressively using down shifting in leu of using the brakes. I would agree that, running the RPM's up in the interest of "saving" brake wear components is not wise. I find it exteremely difficult to accept that your instructor was encouraging continued fuel delivery at the same time as braking to prevent the engine from braking the vehicle.

If he was, I hope he is not teaching any of the 10,000's of big rig professionals I share the mountain with every day. Using their engine's braking power for the decent is absolutely mandatory just to keep their brakes working. Professional grade drivers with professional grade machines use their engine's braking power.

I do not plan to start putting my car in neutral and riding down the mountain on my brakes and I do not believe your instructor would advocate this either.

Motor on! :)

-Scott
 

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Thanks for the greetz, RiverMasterNC!

In retrospect, I have to ask if you have an automatic transmission? My particular argument is primarily aimed at people with manual transmissions who, as you said, aggressively downshift to slow their vehicles, at the expense of their engines. Obviously, this has nothing to do with people with automatic transmissions, nor in purely lifting off the throttle as you have indicated you do. I apologize if I came across severely opinionated -- I'm used to participating in forums where the majority of vehicles have manual and not automatic transmissions, which has biased my view (when your only tool is a hammer, everything looks like a nail!)

I do shift into neutral often, as I'd rather coast than leave my foot on the gas to slowly decelerate. But then, I've got a 6 speed manual (I just *love* saying six!), and I do stay prepared to shift back into gear in case of some unexpected event.

BTW, I have posted pics of my ride over in csportcoupe.com:

http://www.csportcoupe.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2365

If you don't have an account there, I'll post pics here too, after I get my AMG wheels on tomorrow and my tint done Friday.

Best,
Aaron
 

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Aaron:

Yes, mine is definately automatic. Pictures with some basic information are posted on my personal webspace at:

http://web.infoave.net/~ontheriver/automobiles

I figured we were visualizing two different ideas of "engine braking". In diesels, it is often common to find the specification for "Braking Power" to be lined up with the HP, torque, displacement, etc.

I was not able to enter the C-Coupe site without signing up. I elected not to sign up just for that. I'll wait but looking forward to seeing a picture. I've thought the coupe might make a great commuter car, but not sure I can justify the depreciation. I'm running around 45K miles per year with a 110 mile commute each way.

Dieseling in NC,
Scott
 

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Kleen Wheels

The Kleen Wheels people state that there have been design changes that now incorporate a vented, slotted and fan-effect that channels cool air into the rotor area and actually offers the braking components cooler temperatures to operate under than without the device. Few people have reported service issues anytime recently.

As far as what "MB recommends," I would imagine MB recommends many things that rightly should stand the test of filteration. MB "exclusive parts and accessories" for instance. The same exact OEM parts can be purchased on eBay for a fraction of the excessive price from dealerships. I would imagine that "MB recommends" the stock OEM brake pads, too. Yet, evidence states that the dusting from these stock pads actually HURTS the alloy wheels! So, MB discouraging Kleen Wheels is of their own interests, indifference and ignorance; their components cause as much harm and this is of recent, demonstrable information, not dated.

I have just ordered the Porterfield brake pads through myroadster.com. Jerry has the whole process very scientifically understood and offers the best means to accomodate the dusting, as well as squealing issues. Even the price is reasonable.

http://www.myroadster.net/

Christopher
 

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Gee, thanks for posting the pic, Lynn! You're all over it... :)

I got my wheels on today, and will be getting my tinting done Friday. I'll take new pics this weekend -- I'm really pleased with the AMG wheels! I'll also be putting my new swaybars on this weekend -- gotta have something fun to do this weekend! Watch the picture forum...

I've thought the coupe might make a great commuter car, but not sure I can justify the depreciation. I'm running around 45K miles per year with a 110 mile commute each way.
I think the 31 MPG plus zero maintenance for 4 years will help me afford it! Of course, you'd use up the warranty in a little over 1 year, so I understand your concern. I'm also quite comfortable in it; although I've not yet done any long distance runs, I can see the occasional 200 to 500 mile jaunts I pull will be a joy! The flexibility the hatchback offers is astounding -- I had 4 boxes of wheels plus both kids in the car this morning, and this afternoon, the cavernous rear swallowed up 4 mounted tires and wheels, with room to spare!

Re: brake dust

Yes, back on topic:
I've also read lots of good things about the various brake pad alternatives out there, and would think that the combination of higher performance and lower dust pads should be what the factory installs. I don't quite understand why we get second rate pads from the factory on a Benz. :? Especially when we're talking about safety and appearance -- two of the MB hallmarks!

Aaron
 

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Good thread!

Brake pad compounds
I used a metal compoud (can't remember the name now) recommended by my Indie for a while. They did last a little longer and reduced the dust, but the cost was added wear to the rotors. I have since returned to the MB factory pads. I was getting new rotors every other pad change.

Alphaman's HotWheels
Very sharp! Thanks for posting the picture Lynn. This will be great to see the before and after with the customizations.

300SD vs Coupe Economy
Averaging just over 26 MPG in the 300SD and assuming you have to burn Premium in the Coupe, as we do in the E320, operating costs will probably be a wash. I have the SD serviced at the dealership every 30,000 (9 months) at an average cost of around $1,100, including additional work I do not like to do (brake fluid, coolant flush, ATF & filter, etc.). Most of these items should probably be done on the Coupe as well, albiet less expensive. Depreciation still a biggie. I bought the SD in 1990 for $16K and have personally logged 310K miles on her. I would estimate her value today at $2,500.

Kleen Wheels - C2Jones:
Yes, they have vents in them to channel air directly to the brake components. This was what I was referring in my earlier post regarding making sure they are mounted on the correct side of the vehicle. I also somewhat agree with the "If we don't make it, we don't recommend it" theory, but besides aftermarket product profitability, I would imagine there are liability issues. How can they recommend something they have no controls over? Product liability issues continue to increase concerns as tort attorneys find ways to target the "deep pockets."

TGIF!

-Scott
 

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RivermasterNC said:
Good thread!

Alphaman's HotWheels
Very sharp! Thanks for posting the picture Lynn. This will be great to see the before and after with the customizations.
:
:[majorus snipolus]
:
TGIF!

-Scott
And what a great Friday it was! As promised, I've posted pics of the Benz HotWheels [tm], which you can find here. Okay, that's the last I'm going to post for a while -- I've gotta go install my sway bars and DRIVE!!!!!!!!! Or, to use the local vernacular, Yeeeehaw!!!

Regards,
Aaron
 
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